[Guest]

Over the Holidays I had an opportunity to photograph a nice DWM 1918 long barreled Luger from a close friend's collection. He acquired the piece in the late 50's on a trade and has kept it in nice condition since.

While I own and appreciate the historical value of many surplus arms, I know very little about Lugers. Any insight you can provide would be helpful.

The piece appears to be a 1918 DWM Artillery Luger. The attached photos will give you a feel for condition (which is very nice, I have fired this weapon) as well as the appropriate proofs / stampings.

My first question has to do with the numbers / letter stamped on the underside of the barrel. They do not match the serial number of the frame. Does this indicate a "rework", maybe even post war?

Is there a web site or a good reference text that will provide me with information concerning the proofs on the right side of the frame (I'm assuming that as with long guns, the inspection stamps are traceable to inspectors / factories) as well as the meaning of any acceptance stamps?

I've been a fan of Gunboards for years and am glad to see Jan offer this forum. I've got several other pistols (Dryse)I'll post for discussion later.


Download Attachment: Luger B.jpg
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Download Attachment: Luger C.jpg
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[Jan C Still]

Too clever
Need more details on the 1918 LP08. It appears not to have a proof on the barrel?
Jan

 

[Dwight Gruber]

quote:Originally posted by TooClever
My first question has to do with the numbers / letter stamped on the underside of the barrel. They do not match the serial number of the frame. Does this indicate a "rework", maybe even post war?

Is there a web site or a good reference text that will provide me with information concerning the proofs on the right side of the frame (I'm assuming that as with long guns, the inspection stamps are traceable to inspectors / factories) as well as the meaning of any acceptance stamps?

The number mismatch only indicates that the gun has been rebarrelled. "Rework" is a very slippery term, meaning different things to different people, and without further information there is no possibility of determining when the rebarrelling was done. One would expect that if this was a period arsenal repair the replacement barrel would have been numbered to the gun. Does the left receiver number match the barrel number? the frame number?

More photos of this Luger would certainly prove interesting.

Your assumption about the inspectors' marks is correct. The best reference text for this subject is "German Small Arms Markings", Joachim Görtz and Don L. Bryans, 1997, Walsworth Publishing Co.

--Dwight

 

[Guest]

I can post additional photos. What would you like to see?

Download Attachment: Luger D.jpg
272.42KB see?

 

[Guest]

Here's a photo of the left side of the frame with the serial numbers.


Download Attachment: Luger E.jpg
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[Edward Tinker]

David, as many pictures as you can upload.

Full side views, any proofs, markings, etc., not already displayed.

Ed

 

[Guest]

Thanks for you help and sorry for the delay in posting the additional pics (I'm still running off of a standard land line, need to upgrade).

The only proofs, stamps, or markings are; the proof / acceptance stamps on the right side of the frame, the under barrel markings that do not match the serial numbers for the frame, the serial numbers stamped on the left side of the frame, and the DWM logo on the top of the receiver.

I'm posting a few additional photos this morning with the hope it will give you the information needed to comment.


Download Attachment: Luger H.jpg
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[Guest]

And one more from the left side.


Download Attachment: Luger I.jpg
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[Dwight Gruber]

Observations so far--

It looks like the numbers on the sight do not match the frame or the barrel.

The photos are awefully shiny, it looks like the gun may have been buffed/polished. Are the small parts--trigger, locking lever, safety lever, magazine button etc.--strawwed or blued?

It appears that the barrel is shorter than 8", that the barrel band has been cut off and a new sight base and front sight attached. Is this really the case?

Actually, now that I look closely, your 10:23am photo shows that this gun has a rear sight on the toggle, firm evidence that this Luger did not start out life as an LP-08.

--Dwight

 

[Ron Wood]

The left side photo of your Luger tells the story of your non-matching barrel. At some time in the past a custom barrel has been installed that has been shortened and a new front sight added. A nice job and the attached picture illustrates the difference.
Arty Compare.jpg

 

[Guest]

OK, looks like I've learned quite a lot. This piece didn't start out life as a "long" barreled Luger. The barrel appears to be a replacement as well as the leaf sight (numbers on the sight base do not match the last digits on the frame.). I'm also going to assume the current barrel length is not a standard military configuration.

By looking at the proofs and acceptance stamps, can anyone tell me what they believe the original configuration was?

In addition, I'm curious about the meaning of the markings on the underside of the barrel. To me it looks like a four digit serial type marking, over a cursive "C" or "E", and then a lighter stamping that looks to be "3,33"

David

 

[Dwight Gruber]

No need to refer to "proof and acceptance stamps" (they wouldn't give you the information anyway), count on this gun being originally a standard 4" barrel P-08. The only other option, a 6" barrel Navy Luger, is not likely because the rear sight and left receiver marks would be radically different.

The cursive letter under the four-digit number under the barrel is properly part of the serial number. Lugers were serially-numbered starting with 1, going through 9999. The sequence was then repeated followed by a script, lower case a , then b , and so on. The serial number under the barrel is, then, 2374l (thats a lower-case 'L', hard to differentiate in this typeface). This barrel is probably from an LP-08 manufactured in 1917, as that is the only year this letter is reported on Artillery Lugers (as of 1991--Still, "Imperial Lugers").

It is important to note here that the "official" (as far as ATF is concerned) serial number of a Luger is the frame number.

8,88 is the measured land-to-land diameter of the bore in mm.

--Dwight

 

[Guest]

Thanks for you help. The assistance and wealth of information on these boards is second to none. By the way, the close friend who let me photograph his Luger is my Father-in-Law. He has always encouraged me in my collecting to the point of giving me a mint M91 Argentine Mauser a few years back for a B-day.

Thanks again for the support.

David