[nhdblfan]

Greetings all,
Having been an avid gun collector (mostly older sporting dbl shotguns and rifles with a few Colt SAA'a). I have caught the luger bug. I recently recieved my Weimar Luger Book from Mr Still, its a great one as is this board and thought I would post some info and pics ( sorry for quality) on a Police Luger I picked up a few years ago at a large gun auction. Its just a shooter but it was suggested, on the new collectors board, that I post here as there are members who collect data on these. Would be happy to answer any questions about it for them as well.

Ok here goes, as I said its a shooter (last minute buy, was less than the commision on the gun I was standing in line to pay for) while checking out with another purchase, never even looked at it in preview. Not high % (maybe 85-89),grips nicked, and holster missing loading tool pouch. Numbers on gun match, except mag, bore is fine and gun functions and shoots great.

1929-30 DWM ( marked on toggle) BKIW Police, has L.LI.188. (Rural Constible,Liengnitz district per book). on front grip strap serial number 1710 with a U suffix all numbers on gun match except wood bottom mag which is marked 2979 with an I under it. The holster is brown with a buckle and is Marked PBg.488 ( Police school Burg per book), not sure if that would be a possible that it was with gun or added later. perhaps someone could help with their thoughts.

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Hope some of this is useful,more than happy to answer any questions or comments.
Best,
Dave K

 

[Ron Smith]

Hi Dave,

Does'nt look too bad. Actually a pretty decent mid-range collector. Your holster is an Weimar reworked Imperial artillery holster. The stitching holes and capped muzzle end are the indicators. These are becoming collectable in their own right. Unit markings are a big plus.
All in all not a bad rig. The holster can be repaired. Jerry Burney "lugerholsterepair" is a genius with them. Just don't tell him I said so.

Can you post good clear photos of the proofs and top of the pistol?

Ron

 

[donmaus]

Dave,

Thanks very much for posting this information. I'm developing a database of Weimar police marks and am currently researching the Landjaegerei marks, so your info is very timely. I do have a couple of additional questions.

Could you post a clearer photo of the grip strap? The mark should be L.Li. rather than L.LI. I'd like to determine if the "i" is really upper case.

The shadow of the belt loop seems to be obscuring part of the unit mark on the back of the holster. Is the full mark P.Bg.488. by any chance? If so, it could either be for the Brandenburg police school or the police school at Burg, depending on when the mark was made. Judging from the age and the rework, it's probably the former.

 

[Edward Tinker]

Dave, we'd have to see more, but is it considered a "shooter" because of damage, reblue, etc? As Ron says, it looks like a well-used but decent gun to me?

Ones with markings on them are always fun guns to own. I see you live in NH, John D. lives there, and isn't that one of those states you can drive across on a lunch break?

Ed

 

[nhdblfan]

hi Ron, Don and Ed,
many thanks for checking out my Luger and info you provided.

Ron, thanks for info on holster,I will check in with Jerry about repair.Would the explain the missing loading tool pouch ( holes present but no pouch) or is it just missing?

Here is one of the top will see if I can take a better one later

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here is only other good one I have
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I will try and take better ones of top and proofs later and post them.
Don,
I will also try for better grip strap.The stamping is,as you say L.Li.188. ( the dot on the small "i" goes as high as the top of big "L" so its hard to see in my blury pics) As to the holster I checked the stamp on it under magnification ( middle age eyesite going) and it is PBg.488, its very close to strap which now looking at it is different from other strap (thicker) That would be police school in Berg I guess, is that a possibilty with this Luger?
I also have numbers on front of holster "3468" hidden under top about grip height.
Ed ,
yes I am in NH ( who is John D?),I escaped the peoples socialist republic of New Jersey 7 years ago, my wife I and my two labs are loving it ! Great pro gun state, carry permit, no problem, C and R- no problem, can't belive I took so long to get away from the gun grapping liberals in NJ.
as to the gun, I guess I am considering it a shooter as it is not perfect ( example Colt Saa's are best if "unfired and unturned"),it is not reblued just has been used. I have about $300 in it so its no big thing, quite sure my next one will be a good deal more and hopefully much better condition wise.
Thanks all for compliments and advice on Luger,I welcome more in put and will be back with better pics,hopefully not boring you all by running on.

Best,
Dave

 

[donmaus]

Dave,

The holster unit mark is interesting. It is definitely the police school at Burg and it was definitely marked in 1932 or later (assuming your omission of a period between the P and Bg is not a typo!) per the marking orders issued that year. I am publishing an article in the February AutoMag that gives a full explanation of the Prussian police school marks.

My research on the Landjaegerei marks leads me to believe that the pistol was also marked following the issue of the 1932 orders, so it is very unlikely that this pistol and holster were together at that time. Odds are, these were married much, much later.

 

[nhdblfan]

Hi Don,
yes there is no period between the "P" and the "Bg". I kinda suspected it was a married later deal,thanks for info. Perhaps I should try and find a "correct" holster and sell this one off.With double shotguns there is a "split pair" site for reuniteing pairs and three gun sets that had been split over the years, perhaps a numbered mag and holster search site would be sucessful ?
Here are a couple more pics, a bit better (except for proofs)

Top
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Grip strap

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Side

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Holster serial number

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could not get good close up of proofs but will describe;on right side of frame 1st) a Dove like figure( not like anything in book),looking left with a penquin toed feet and 2 sets of wings-then 2nd)the "e/wa66" symbol on page 2.Then on barrel the e/h symbol ( but no "H" under bird) Hope this helps, would certainly be interested in finding out more on Burg police school, Leingnitz district or simliar marked pieces.
Best,
Dave K

 

[Edward Tinker]

$300, well that was a good deal. If you decide to sell, or trade?

Ed

 

[donmaus]

Dave,

A few more facts may be of interest to you.

The Landjaegerei unit marks are fairly common. In my database of Weimar police marks, they constitute about 25% of all marks, the largest population recorded (127). I recently purchased one of these Lugers, 85% blue, all matching except mag, sear and clipped mag safeties, for $600.

On the other hand, there are only 24 police school marks (on Lugers, C96s, M1914s and holsters), constituting only about 5% of my database. And of this, only three items (your holster, one Luger and one Mauser M1914) are marked in full compliance with the 1932 marking orders. In other words, the mark on the back of your holster is quite rare! Whether this translates into $$$ or not, I don't know.

 

[nhdblfan]

Hi Don, thank you for the further info,the data base you are building is very intersting as are the unit marked Police Luger's.
I will probably hold on to holster ( would be happy to send you a better pic of the marking if you like as well just let me know and I will take a better pic and send it),and contiue to search for more unit market items. I did do a "goggle" on the Burg police school and it came up with one that was set up in 46' for training of troops for post war duties,woder if that was same school during the 30's ?
I figure that my luger is probably worth about the same as yours and will just keep it in safe with some occaisional plinking use.
Presently thinking of ways to find some hidden treasures in the Luger area,perhaps a small local ad in paper would unearth a few as well as perusing the auction possibilities.
Again, thank you so much for info, really adds to enjoyment of hobby. Damn this is fun!
Best,
Dave K

 

[Edward Tinker]

Dave, putting the word out is a great way to get unexpected items. I have a german website, just on police, and will try and send you the link tonight, although at one time it was posted here.

Ed

 

[donmaus]

Dave,
The Burg police school that marked your holster is the same one referred to in the 1922 marking orders as Polizeischule Sachsen (P.S.). In those orders, the schools were named for the Prussian Provinces they served. However, they were routinely referred to by the city in which they were located (Burg, in this instance) and, in 1926, orders were issued that henceforth they would be named for these cities. I assume that this facility was used after the war as you have described. If you are an NAPCA member, I think you will find my article on this topic in the Feruary issue of AUTO MAG interesting.