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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm now seriously researching Dreyse Model 1907 pistols and need data from members' pistols. Please email me directly at [email protected] if you'd prefer not to post here.

The Dreyse 1907's were made in a number of interesting variations. Slide serration patterns were changed many times. Most of the pistols have vertical serrations which extend from the slide's surface. Later pistols have slanted serrations which extend from the slide's surface or conversely may be cut into the slide itself. Early pistols have still different slide serrations and also have different style grips. There were also changes in factory markings and frame profile. Many of these pistols also show police or unit markings. The Dreyse 1907 is a field begging for original research.

Still's Volume I estimates the range for Imperial proofed Dreyses to run from 113324 to 190775. I'd like to expand this range and have posted Imperial proofed #194652 below. I'd also like to know if strictly commercial pistols are intermixed within this range. In essence, I want to learn everything possible regarding the Dreyse Model 1907 pistols and need members' help to do so.


Dreyse194652R.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
<<I would prefer that all this be kept within the site so it benefits all the members. Jan>>

I understand and agree that public posts are the most valuable; however, I think you will also agree that an all or nothing policy regarding posts will lose valuable data at the margin from people who would be willing to email, but, are too shy, or concerned with confidentiality, to post. Be assured that I am not trying to undermine the forum and merely want to capture all possible data for legitimate research reasons.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
<<Have 3 Dreyse 07's all with vertical cuts: #277143, marked K.Pr.Z.V. No 2515, in a black unmarked police type holster with spare magazine, mags are un-numbered; #128692 in a brown WW I style holster, numbered to the pistol, and #15625, marked K.P.P.B. No 6862, in a black(?) police type holster marked S.M. 199, with two magazines, one with matching (K.P.P.B 6862'"I") number. (mag 6862 # 1 for the pistol)>>

Thank you for the great data.

#15625: Does this pistol have the grip screw through the center of the grip, or, on the periphery?

#277143: This pistol is dramatically higher than the highest known serial number. Could you please reconfirm the serial? If you've accidentally doubled the "7" and the actual number is #27143, please advise on the location of the grip screw.

#128692: Does this pistol have an Imperial proof beside the ejection port?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
<<I do not have an Imperial proofed Dreyse, but I do have serial number 368 that has the very early type cocking serrations on a panel that extends down from the slide and over the frame. I haven't seen any other examples of this type, but I do have photocopy of a page from an early ALFA catalog (don't know the date) that shows this variation as a "Polizeimodell" and offers it for sale for Mark 60.>>

This is a very pleasing early Dreyse. I like it better than any Imperial proofed example. Thank you for posting it.

The ALFA catalog you mention is almost certainly the 1911 issue, as this one has been widely reprinted. It shows your type Dreyse along with a later variation .32.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
<<Like Ron I do have commercial proofed SN 626. It is the second version. Assumed SN range 300 - 6000. My PC is not able to send a pictures.>>

You may have a firewall problem that prevents posting pictures. You are welcome to email me pictures directly at [email protected].

What is your source for this 300-6000 serial range? What documentation do you have on the earlier variation?

You may have a non-English Dreyse article that I haven't seen. The only earlier pistol I have seen is in Mathews and it is not marked Dreyse. Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
<<What is the serial number of the Dreyse in that reference and does it have the cocking serrations on a panel like mine?>>

The Mathews Dreyse is #170 and does not have overhanging slide serrations. The most unique feature of this pistol is that it does not have a sight channel. The slide is flat on top. The gun is also not marked "Dreyse" and is instead marked "K.S. Gend 170." I don't know if this pistol was part of a special contract with a unique serial range or in the same sequence with all other Dreyses. Zhuk shows another flat top slide pistol, also without the Dreyse name, and marked "K.S. Gem. Ld." If any member can identify these markings, or explain these pistols, please let me know.

<<I have no documentation, but in discussions over the years I have been led to believe that the first 500 pieces had the panel, and then it was eliminated to greatly simplify machining.>>

I've barely started researching, but, already know the "panel" goes into 4 digit serial numbers.

<<I hope your research can better establish the serial number ranges of the different variations.>>

If you guys keep helping, I think it will eventually be definitive.
 

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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Thank you for all the great Dreyse data gentlemen. I've already established a good framework for researching these pistols.

My first major question has already been answered. Not all of the pistols between 113324 and 190775 are Imperial German marked. I've now seen two pistols in this range without Imperial German markings. One had 1916 Austrian commercial proofs, in addition to the German commercial proofs. The other had 1917 Austrian military proofs, in addition to the German commercial proofs. Is Volume One's statement that "about 80000 .... were officially procured" based on more documentation than the serial range above?

I've also encountered what appears to be an Imperial marking which differs from those shown in Volume One. Let me know what you think of this marking, which is shown below.

Download Attachment: DreyseImperial.jpg
42.19KB
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
<<It is marked "Rheinische", but I'm not sure how to tell the diffrence when it comes to the rear sight.>>

The pistol pictured at the left has a reinforced rear sight. The gun on the right has a standard rear sight.

Download Attachment: Dreysesight.jpg
36.98 KB

I'd also like to know if your pistol has angled slide serrations or vertical slide serrations. Both types are shown in the photo below. Thank you.

Download Attachment: Dreyseserrations.jpg
31.44 KB
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
<<I will try to get a digital if you need one.>>

I would like to see a photo of this pistol. It's much earlier than any reinforced rear sight pistol I've heard of yet. I would expect it to have an Imperial proof near the ejection port though. Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
<<DREYSE 1907 7,65 216724 C/N VG CONDITION-RHEINMETALL
R.F.V. NO 3251 W/HOLSTER
DREYSE 1907 7,65 219976 C/N VG CONDITION-RHEINMETALL>>

These are the earliest Rheinmetall marked Dreyses I've heard of yet. Please advise on whether they have reinforced rear sights and the type of slide serrations.

<<DREYSE 1907 7,65 244024 99+%..NO MFG NAME...CROWN/N>>

I expect the above pistol has slanted slide serrations. Are these serrations cut into the slide, or, do they extend above the main surface of the slide? Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
<<POLICE MARKED M07 SN 225766, frame left side: SÄCHS. GEND. No. 813; front grip: L.G. In the WTS Koblenz under inventory number 0008018.>>

Please advise on the following:

1. Reinforced rear sight or not?
2. Type of slide serrations?
3. Marked Rheinmetall or Rheinische?

Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
<<ser no.222860, slanted serrations, RFV No.5105 marked (Reichs Finance Verwaltung), un-numbered mag, grip screw through the center of the grips and it has a reinforced rear sight.>>

Is this pistol marked Rheinmetall or Rheinische?

Thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #50 ·
<<#19378x austrian marked Wn/eagle/15>>

This pistol is particularly interesting, especially since you confirmed the date. There has long been debate about what year production of these pistols ended. I've heard 1914, 1915, and 1918 among other years.

Are you able to post photos of this pistol? If a serial number this high had already been manufactured by 1915 or earlier, the history of these Dreyses may become significantly clearer. I hope to hear much more about your pistol.
 

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Discussion Starter · #59 ·
<<Any idea of when this particular pistol was manufactured?>>

I think the crown over u proofs mean that it's earlier than 1912. Someone here surely has more expertise on German proofs than I do though.

I've seen several pistols in this serial range, all with the same bullseye style safety with concentric rings.
 
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