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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
This one is also described in 'The Mauser Parabellum'.
 

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Has anyone else seen the article, “The Luger Pistol: Incontrovertibly Made in England - A Case of Co-operation or Collusion in the Post-1918 British and German Smallarms Industries” by Dr. Stephen C. Sambrook? It was published in the Journal of the Historical Breechloading Smallarms Association, Volume 4, No.1, published in 2009. In the article, using Vickers documents, he asserts that Vickers actually made (on their own machinery) 6000 Lugers for the Dutch. It is a very in-depth long article that is quite convincing. Any opinions? I am not a Luger collector but if I was this would be the Luger I would want!
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Goertz and Sturgess also looked into the matter and also concluded Vickers made the pistols and did not assemble DWM bits.

My Vickers was marked 'not English make' when it was re-imported and shipped out to Israel. 😂
 

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@Poilu Haven't read it and I don't think I'd pay $12 to download it. He's better known for his one book on Military Optics. Post WW-I was a mess, particularly for Vickers and Armstrong, which were military weapons manufacturers and tied up with reparations and debt with Germany after WW-I. Martins and D Vries (Dutch Lugers 1994) clearly show that major parts of the Vickers Luger were manufactured in Germany by DWM and shipped to Vickers (frame, breach, toggle links, etc.)

I love to read what Sambrook wrote, but more importantly, what sources he cited.

Interestingly, I have a history of Vickers book (J.D. Scott 1982) which says absolutely nothing about the Dutch Lugers, but it goes on in detail about the debt and bailouts both of these companies required after WW-1.

I agree that Vickers assembled Dutch Lugers, but it's really doubtful they had all the machinery to make all of the parts.
 

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I’ll have to figure out how to make this article available. It’s 15 pages long. He does make a convincing argument for Vickers machinery making the parts based on documentation quoting large amounts of cash spent on machinery for the contract—
 

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I simply can not understand how a company could survive on only 10,000 lugers.

However, that is the amount Simson made - although they were sold Erfurt equipment. My point is that I find it unlikely they made all the parts - I now have doubts because of the same conundrum. Didn't the Dutch Luger have documents that parts were sold to vickers?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
Vickers took a huge loss on the Dutch contract. But they were a pretty large and well to do business, so at the time it was just a write-off.

It seems DWM had the last laugh, after the Interallied Control Commission stopped, DWM started cranking out Lugers cheaper than Vickers could make, instantly killing any Vickers markets.
 

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Here’s the link to purchase the HBSA Volume 4, No.1 Journal. It is very well worth the nominal cost of about $13.00 if one finds the Vicker’s Luger subject interesting.
 

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The HBSA is a very comprehensive organization. A great group of collectors, historians and enthusiast. To be a member I was “required “ to go to a classic arms shooting event at Bisley—
 
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