[keoki7]

I've been trying to fulfill some commitments made to Jan regarding photos. Alas, I have not yet found those that I was looking for but did come across these. The lanyard is thought to be a WWII period lanyard for a P08. It measures 40" in length.

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The photo is one of a trench raiding party with some newly taken Canadian POW's. You might note that the Canadian seem more pleased with the circumstances than do their captors. The photo seems to have been taken in 1915 or later.

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You might note that most or all of the Germans are P08 armed. Bread bag strap for a lanyard. Right hand pocket for a holster. I would bet that the left hand pockets are stuffed with magazines.

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What does this photo say to matched magazines? Unnumbered magazines? armorer replacements?

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I have read that the Imperial German Army was the most "pistol armed" army up until its time. This phot and others that I have seem to confirm that.

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[Heinz]

George, I think you bring upa great point on unmatched magazines. It is an interesting hypothesis that Lugers may have been issued to patrols such as you picture, on a task basis and the pistols and magazines turned in on return from the patrol. Someone reloaded the empties and put them in a case for the next patrol issue. This would explain Datig's remark form the 50's that not one Luger in 100 would be found with a matched magazine.

Does anyone have numbers on the number of Imprial P08s ordered versus the number of holsters ordered?

Happy New Year to all

 

[keoki7]

Heinz, along the same line, here's another photo. I don't own this photograph. I don't know who does.

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[Heinz]

Great shot George, Thanks

 

[Edward Tinker]

Thanks George, very interesting.

Ed

 

[keoki7]

At the show in Louisville I picked up two lanyards which the seller said he had bought in Switzerland. He had quite an extensive display of Swiss lugers and accoutrements. Some of the lugers he presented were very rare.

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From left to right, lanyard I picked up at a private museum sale in Pennsylvania. It was attached to a 1916 DWM P08. The owner said that he had bought the luger twenty plus years earlier and the lanyard was attached to it then. It is 36 3/4 " long.

Middle and right are the two lanyards I bought last week that were represented as being Swiss. I have no doubt that the seller bought them in Switzerland. They are 35" and 37" respectively.

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I showed the lanyards to a pair of Luger "experts". The immediate reaction from one was that the lanyard on the right is phoney "probably made by ----- -----." The other "expert" stated the lanyard pictured in the center was definitely Portugese.

A third Luger "expert" told me that they were certainly WWI German and that they were worth $300 apiece.

The Swiss "expert" that I bought them from would not budge on his price when I tried to work him down so I went ahead and paid him $30.00 each for them.

 

[lugerholsterrepair]

George, An excellent post! Fabulous photo's of German troops.

The lanyards you bought are the steal of the decade! I will say right now that there is no question of their authenticity. Everything is right about them. The brass swivels are beautifully made, and every detail indicates these are rare genuine WW1 vintage German issue lanyards. I have an album of photographs sent to me by a European collector that went to many European collections and photographed lanyards for me. These are identical to known German issue lanyards.

I have studied this interesting subject for many years and have made over a hundred reproduction lanyards for shooters who do not want to drop their pistols at the range. This is a rare accoutrement that has been overlooked by most collectors and to be able to buy one of these at a major gun show for only $30.00 is astounding. It just goes to show you that bargains are still out there if you know what you are looking at.

Any collector who looked at one of these and could not determine authenticity has not studied the subject thouroughly. I have to congratulate George for knowing what they are!

George I am anxious to get a look at them and I thank you very much my Friend...Jerry Burney

 

[Doubs]

"The Swiss "expert" that I bought them from would not budge on his price when I tried to work him down so I went ahead and paid him $30.00 each for them."

Psssssssst....... George....... wanna make a fast $20 profit? ;^)

Seriously, the leather workmanship on all three is absolutely fabulous. The brass "furniture" is beautifully made as well. A wonderful buy, George.

 

[Guest_V]

I´ve literally been waiting for this info for years. Neither Goertz nor Reckendorf were able to help. The problem was that no lanyards have come up with any form of acceptance or unit stamps. Some years ago, bags of Portuguese holsters, together with similar lanyards were on the market here in Germany. None of the lanyards had the pleated ends, the same quality brass swivel or the two leather toggles.

It was generally accepted that the Portuguese equipment was based on the original German model.

I know that officers had lanyards etc made for them at their own expense.

I purchased this luger lanyard recently (see pic. `43). It was poorly made, but has one leather toggle. The swivel is definitely NOT new – but it is not the same quality as the brass swivels. It DOES have a stamp (which is why I bought it). But this could still be one of the Portuguese types.




The following pic. Is from the recent Hermann Historica Catalogue and shows a Persian LP 08. The lanyards would have been delivered as part of the original contract.



So, would it be reasonable to accept that the quality lanyards (pleated, brass swivel and two leather toggles) would almost certainly be WWI; that during WWI and WWII, lanyards were not frequently issued (unlike other countries) – and that the cheaper made varieties are either Portuguese or (maybe) WWII.

Last pic is of a copy made (and used) by me:-



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[lugerholsterrepair]

Patrick, Thanks for your input on this fascinating subject. I have seen the lanyard and swivel you speak of as being possibly Portugese or WW2. I have yet to determine what a Poutugese lanyard really is or what it looks like. It is my understanding that they were made not with the rounded leather like the German lanyards but with the braided leather, similar to BOLO ties. I cannot confirm this for as far as I know this information has been lost to time. At least I can find no authority on the subject.

I have several photo's of Bulgarian Soldiers wearing what appear to be WW1 era German holsters and lanyards.

I believe you told me long ago that your Father was a German Soldier and you have his Lanyard. Also that many Soldiers in WW2 used the bread bag strap as a lanyard. Good to hear from you! Jerry Burney

 

[Guest_V]

Jerry,

the Potruguese lanyards that flooded the market here some years ago were definitely ALL of the round leather "bootlace" type, but the round leather strip was thinner than on lanyards with brass swivels. Also, they were not pleated and did not have sliding leather toggles. Here´s a pic of my father´s 08 lanyard. It was most likely only used on parade. He served with the Freikorps in the Baltic after the end of WWI.

The "bootlace" leather strip is still quite common here - used on peddal drive sewing machines.

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[lugerholsterrepair]

Patrick, Thanks for this great photo of your Father's lanyard. Do you have any photo's of him in uniform? That would be a treat!

I have only heard rumors of the Portugese lanyard. Michael Reese describes the lanyard pictured in Luger Tips as a Portugese but I don't believe it , it is made exactly on the German WW1 round leather, brass swivel pattern. It recently came up for sale and was bought by a Friend of mine.

If anyone out there has any more information I would like to know moreabout this subject.

By the way Patrick, how's the weather in Germany this time of year? Are you still scheduled for the Normandy Jump?

Jerry Burney

 

[Guest_V]

Hi Jerry,

am taking part in a Berlin police boxing programme to get at least a bit fitter for the Normandy & Arnhem jumps. I sincerely believe that it´s in violation of the Hague Conventions to put a seventy year old geriatric through their torture chamber. I´ll look to see if I can find any of m´father´s photos - they were in Stahlhelm uniform. Weather here is freezing. Patrick

 

[lugerholsterrepair]

Patrick, I would dearly love to see any photo's of your Father you may have. I look forward to it.
Can't you get into shape without getting punched in the face?
Should be around 70 degrees here in Yuma AZ today. I have to go back to the Colorado Mountains in two weeks so I will get some freezing myself.

I will keep an eye out for your photo's. Jerry Burney