Mauser HSc with odd slide finish
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Roid:
Have you taken the pistol apart to see if the slide is serial numbered to the pistol? The last three digits of your serial (069) should be electropenciled under the muzzle end of the slide. Also, the 069 should be stamped on the bottom of the barrel breech.
Have you taken the pistol apart to see if the slide is serial numbered to the pistol? The last three digits of your serial (069) should be electropenciled under the muzzle end of the slide. Also, the 069 should be stamped on the bottom of the barrel breech.
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Before explaining the variant slide mismatch as a possible metallurgical or bluing problem, wouldn't it be logical to first make sure that the pistol is not mismatched? It's hard to imagine that such a pistol would have slipped by inspectors during the very early production of these highly finished Army variations. That's why I suggested early in this thread that Ron verify that the last three digits (069) of the serial number are electropenciled under the muzzle end of the slide...
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If HSc has matching numbers in my humble option makes no difference as parts were not blued at the same time or batch. Ron hit the nail right on the head regarding temperature of bluing salts.
I am not an expert on HSc's, however I have never seen one with that color slide.
George
I am not an expert on HSc's, however I have never seen one with that color slide.
George
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You may have a point, but I find it difficult to believe that Mauser final inspectors would have allowed that pistol to be among the initial, highly-finished pistols delivered to the Army in early 1941. I also have not seen another such HSc example, especially in this very early production. An extensive database that includes a dozen or so HSc's in the 723 000 range don't indicate a similar problem.
All of this could be academic if the slide isn't matching. Ron, you'll satisfy everyone if you'll post a photo of the three digits under the slide.
All of this could be academic if the slide isn't matching. Ron, you'll satisfy everyone if you'll post a photo of the three digits under the slide.
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Peter:
I am by no means an expert on gun finishes. Over the years by what I have seen and read this finish does not just happen. This plum color develops over time. The belief is that the reason this happens is because the Hot Bluing Salts were not keep at the correct temperature.
If this plum color was evident as soon as the parts were removed from the hot salts, the problem would have been corrected and those effected parts would have been rejected.
Not sure on the Mauser HSc, but Mauser went from a rust blue finish to a hot salt bluing in early 1937. The rust blue was a very time and labor intensive process.
If the HSc is all matching or not has nothing to do with the finish. I can't recall ever seeing a slide and frame on any German WW11 pistol that has both the same plum color frame & side!
George
I am by no means an expert on gun finishes. Over the years by what I have seen and read this finish does not just happen. This plum color develops over time. The belief is that the reason this happens is because the Hot Bluing Salts were not keep at the correct temperature.
If this plum color was evident as soon as the parts were removed from the hot salts, the problem would have been corrected and those effected parts would have been rejected.
Not sure on the Mauser HSc, but Mauser went from a rust blue finish to a hot salt bluing in early 1937. The rust blue was a very time and labor intensive process.
If the HSc is all matching or not has nothing to do with the finish. I can't recall ever seeing a slide and frame on any German WW11 pistol that has both the same plum color frame & side!
George
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George:
I, too, am not an expert on finishes and I agree with you about never seeing an HSc with plum color frame and slide. However, I don't understand it when you say "If the HSc is all matching or not has nothing to do with the finish" . What if the slide came from a pistol that had been exposed to very high heat often resulting from combat operations.
That's why learning if the slide matches the pistol is fundamental!
If they match, then let the metallurgical perspectives begin....
It is strange that "roid" posts an inquiry on this site and then fails to follow through. Can anyone make out on the photos whether this pistol has a later three-line slide?
Peter
I, too, am not an expert on finishes and I agree with you about never seeing an HSc with plum color frame and slide. However, I don't understand it when you say "If the HSc is all matching or not has nothing to do with the finish" . What if the slide came from a pistol that had been exposed to very high heat often resulting from combat operations.
That's why learning if the slide matches the pistol is fundamental!
If they match, then let the metallurgical perspectives begin....
It is strange that "roid" posts an inquiry on this site and then fails to follow through. Can anyone make out on the photos whether this pistol has a later three-line slide?
Peter
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Peter:
First and foremost, let me say it has been a pleasure discussing this Mauser HSc with you. Second, please keep in mind that I am never wrong! Just kidding Peter. I try to keep an open mind cause with most things it life, they are not always as the appear.
If the HSc is matching, the facts remain the same and that is that the slide is plum color and the frame is a nice high polish blue.
I have no idea if high heat would turn a hot salt blued slide a plum color and do it that evenly? I guess anything is possible. However with Luger's & P38's which is what I mainly collect, the plum color is associated with the temperature of the holt bluing salts.
Possibly ROID will respond in the near future regarding his postings.
George
First and foremost, let me say it has been a pleasure discussing this Mauser HSc with you. Second, please keep in mind that I am never wrong! Just kidding Peter. I try to keep an open mind cause with most things it life, they are not always as the appear.
If the HSc is matching, the facts remain the same and that is that the slide is plum color and the frame is a nice high polish blue.
I have no idea if high heat would turn a hot salt blued slide a plum color and do it that evenly? I guess anything is possible. However with Luger's & P38's which is what I mainly collect, the plum color is associated with the temperature of the holt bluing salts.
Possibly ROID will respond in the near future regarding his postings.
George
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402 Posts
I bought this HSc at the Pittsburgh Expo Mart gun show several years ago from a friend . I bought it Because of the peculiar slide coloring . I knew at the time the pistol was matching . I felt it would have a plus value with this odd color feature . Thanks for you interest and input !
Ron Heming
Ron Heming
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Gentlemen:
I stand humbled before you with hat in hand! Many thanks to Ron for posting those nice, decisive photos to answer the matching question.
It certainly is an unusual combination of finishes for such an early pistol.
Let the metallurgical speculations begin!
Peter
I stand humbled before you with hat in hand! Many thanks to Ron for posting those nice, decisive photos to answer the matching question.
It certainly is an unusual combination of finishes for such an early pistol.
Let the metallurgical speculations begin!
Peter
Hello all,
I am a new poster and trying to lean more about this plumb color affect in the hot salt bluing process. It was touched upon in this tread.
Am I right in understanding that the plumb color did not show on the gun until years later. I see this in P-38's.
Thanks,
GES..............
I am a new poster and trying to lean more about this plumb color affect in the hot salt bluing process. It was touched upon in this tread.
Am I right in understanding that the plumb color did not show on the gun until years later. I see this in P-38's.
Thanks,
GES..............
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