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Presented here is an example, which when found will represent the first attempt of German production of existing FN parts found in the facilities when captured. Serial range will be approximately from 74,000 to 78,000 and will all be 9mm kurz, save for a very few that will be in 7.65mm. The holster has been mis-identified by many as being for other pistols but having observed two dozen or so examples accompanied with a holster, it has been this example that was with this pistol.

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138.5 KB It is difficult to determine the exact waffenamt that is applied on the holster but if logic is any concern it would be WaAB66. However I have my doubts as it appears to be WaAB613 which would be a first found on a holster. Perhaps others may have a better read of this stamp.

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140.87 KB As we view the blued proofs reading right to left we find that the proofs become more pronounced [ struck at a later time ] with the farthest proof to the left being in the white. This proof , in my opinion, is the last and final acceptance stamp thus approving the pistol for purchase.

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Are all acceptance markings on the pistol WaA613? I could not make it out in the picture. Thanks
Anthony
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Yes, all are WaA613 .
 

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Nice rig, I´m impressed.

The holster was produced by - Ernst Melzig Lederwaren, Liegnitz,
WaA 965. It's the highest WaA number currently observed.
This factory produced holsters only in 1941.

Whittington (Vol.III, page 217) states a very (to) tight fit for a FN 10/22?

If it's from any interest a standart Belgian army holster with the acceptance WaAB 77 is shown below.

Fritz
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
If memory serves me correctly , isn't there a clg 44 issue , waffenamt WaAB66 on a FN HP holster? Your holster is which I take delight in however, as I have never seen such a variation that was proofed let alone a WaAB77 also another first. Very nice. One question though, instead of using captured holsters why or what did the Germans do to this holster that required a waffenamt acceptance stamp ?
 

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quote:Originally posted by Fritz

Nice rig, I´m impressed.

The holster was produced by - Ernst Melzig Lederwaren, Liegnitz,
WaA 965. It's the highest WaA number currently observed.
This factory produced holsters only in 1941.

Whittington (Vol.III, page 217) states a very (to) tight fit for a FN 10/22?

If it's from any interest a standart Belgian army holster with the acceptance WaAB 77 is shown below.

Fritz
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Hello,
FYI- The Belgian army did not adopt any FN1922's in the prewar era. That is a common misconception. Only 1910's and HP's were officially accepted. Only in 1945 was the 1922 purchased in large quantities because it was immediately available from FN.
The holster pattern was available for the commercial market pre-1940. Holsters were primarely made by Fonson in Brussels in the prewar era, but there were also others that were left unmarked (Antwerp makers however are postwar).

I have never seen a prewar commercial holster that has a WaA marking.
Thanks for the pictures.
 

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Hi Anthony,

many thanks for the further information. I have allready seen those particular holsters with the E/ WaAB66 stamp three times.

For your file here another seldom seen FN holster.

It's not a fake, because I bought it as a rig from an German WWII vet.
It's a standart FN HP Belgian army holster without rain protection flap and with brass hardware including nickled rivets.

The holster is WaA 866 accepted, representing the factory of -Otto Stephan Mühlhausen-Thüringen -. Under the flap are some nearly unreadable ink stampings including the stamp 1944 gaq.

The pistol which comes along with this holster is # 33 938 b.

All in all a curious combination.

Fritz

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Anthony,
Couple of questions. So, the 1922 wasn't a Belgian military pistol prior to the German occupation? That would mean that the first ones used by the Belgian military were the "A" prefix that were post liberation? Were they in service before the end of WW2?
Also, what would the last 1910 serials be for pistols used during WW2?
Dean
 

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Anthony,
Couple of questions. So, the 1922 wasn't a Belgian military pistol prior to the German occupation? That would mean that the first ones used by the Belgian military were the "A" prefix that were post liberation? Were they in service before the end of WW2?
Also, what would the last 1910 serials be for pistols used during WW2?
Dean
 

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Nice holsters. I also have a holster like huggiebears which is marked clg 41 and an unreadable WaA. My holster has "rub marks" for a FN 1922 and is die stamped on the rear with the number 75413, this serial is in the 9mmK FN 1922 range.
On the "clg" holsters, have the following reported: P38 clg 42 WaAB66, and clg 43 WaA unreadable...FN HP clg 43 WaAB66 or 866 (I own this one), clg 43 no WaA, clg 44 WaAB66. David Franchi
 

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quote:Originally posted by Dgiz

Anthony,
Couple of questions. So, the 1922 wasn't a Belgian military pistol prior to the German occupation? That would mean that the first ones used by the Belgian military were the "A" prefix that were post liberation? Were they in service before the end of WW2?
Also, what would the last 1910 serials be for pistols used during WW2?
Dean
Hello Dean,
Correct, the 1922 was not accepted by the Belgian military prior to 1945. I even found a comment that the pistol was not allowed even for private purchase prior to the war. That is particularly interesting as it was reviewed by military journals/magazines.

The first Belgian military orders for the A prefix 1922 date from 1945; police departments on the other hand were ordering the pistol beginning in September 1944.
I am not exactly clear on your 1910 question. If you refer to the last of the Belgian military orders for the 1910 I can say that the last of large orders dates from 1933 (if memory serves me well). The Belgian army still purchased it after 33 but in small quantities.
Only the High Power, the 1910 and an occasional 1900 were part of the Belgian arsenal prior to the war.
It is difficult to state exactly where production seized on the 1910s, as there are gaps according to what entered the warehouse. There were 1910s that were indeed seized by the Germans, but it is virtually impossible to give a range. Usually anything that was in warehouse and was not shipped could be part of what the Germans seized or part of what FN employees hid during the invasion.
I hope this helps.
Anthony
 

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Anthony,
Thanks for the reply. I didn't word my question well. I have your book at home, but I am on vacation out of the state. I am sure the info is in there. To rephrase it, I was wondering what the last known serial numbers (ranges) were for Belgian military accepted 1910's prior to German occupation.
Now that I think about it...How many "A" prefix 1922s were there..did they start at A1 or A0001, etc or continue from the German "c" block without the suffix?
Dean
 

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quote:Originally posted by Dgiz

Anthony,
Thanks for the reply. I didn't word my question well. I have your book at home, but I am on vacation out of the state. I am sure the info is in there. To rephrase it, I was wondering what the last known serial numbers (ranges) were for Belgian military accepted 1910's prior to German occupation.
Now that I think about it...How many "A" prefix 1922s were there..did they start at A1 or A0001, etc or continue from the German "c" block without the suffix?
Dean

The "A" prefix Hi-Powers started at 1. Those purchased by the Belgians had a "B" suffix added. I would think that the 1922's were handled in the same manner.
 

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quote:Originally posted by Dgiz

Anthony,
Thanks for the reply. I didn't word my question well. I have your book at home, but I am on vacation out of the state. I am sure the info is in there. To rephrase it, I was wondering what the last known serial numbers (ranges) were for Belgian military accepted 1910's prior to German occupation.
Now that I think about it...How many "A" prefix 1922s were there..did they start at A1 or A0001, etc or continue from the German "c" block without the suffix?
Dean
The last range of Belgian mil. 1910 pistols falls in the 430,000. At least those are the last I have observed. I would not be surprised if there were maybe some that came later as part of a small purchase.

Regarding the A prefix 1922, it is not quite as easy as one might expect. FN Shipping records indicate three ranges, A4001 to A5251, A range starting at A90001 and another starting at A75001. All these ranges were started in 1944 for some unknown reasons to me. On top of that there is a pistol range that started with A001. There is no A1 series to my knowledge. The A001 series may have been sold to a government or may have been a contract, as it does not show in the standard shipping records. In these ranges were also .380 pistols but I believe that those came after 1945.

One would almost need to count the pistols out of the shipping records to get an exact amount as many numbers were left blank early in September 1944. They most likely were never produced as the shipping records and sales records were well kept from the beginning of the liberation. So there are huge gaps in number batches.

I hope this helps.
Anthony
 

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Anthony,
Great information, just what I was looking for. And thanks for all your time and hard work on the Brownings.
Dean
 
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