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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anyone who has searched Roth-Steyr M1907 may have come across this image of what looks to be a variant of the “standard” M.07. Wikipedia uses this image as their representative for the piece. I’m wondering about all the non-standard features shown on it (i.e. extra front sight, modified rear sight and shoulder stock attachment rib). I have since run across another, very similar, image located on http://galerie.valka.cz/showphoto.php/photo/153212 . Similar because it has everything the Wikipedia image has (to include the pegboard-type hangers at front and rear), but yet has an obscure pin at the back of the trigger guard holding a bar inside the guard (that a rearward pull of the trigger could engage – for full auto capability?) along with a weird appendage in the web between the guard and grip that the shooter’s finger could engage (some sort of safety?).
I don’t know that full auto makes sense on only a 10 round capacity – unlike the Steyr-Hahn M.12 with an extended magazine compartment. I’m not even convinced that a shoulder stock and adjustable sights are requisite for the meek 8mm Steyr.
Does anyone have knowledge of any of these features or references discussing them (i.e. experimental prototype, etc.)?
Regards - MadMagyar
 

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It appears to be a variation of the Model 1911 Roth Steyr but I can't tell from the photos. Our forum friend, Josef Motz will know.
Tim H.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanx Tim - If this Josef Moetz is the same Georg Roth, I stumbled into one of his posts (Austrian Pistolbook) from 10/26/2007, 04:52pm, where he mentioned a 1911 experimentation (I could not open the image attachment, it might have been removed) that I would like to know more about also. Without seeing a picture and being so close to 1912 I assumed it was closer to a Steyr-Hahn variety and I didn't pursue any farther - should never "assume".

"An experimental carbine pistol, based on the M.7 Roth/Krnka, of 1911.
15 guns made in Budapest for a small troop trial."


Now I look forward to his comments. And maybe he can repost this image even if it doesn't apply to my version in question.
 

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Although Josef Mötz and Joschi Schuy devoted 175 pages to the Roth Teodorovic/Roth Krnka pistols in their fantastic book "Vom Ursprung der Selbstladepistole", I can find no example that comes even close to the one pictured in the Koblenz Museum/Wikipedia. The rear sight appears to be a variant of the 1911 "Karabiner" pictured on page 565 and the 1911-II on pages 568-569, but the odd trigger, mid-sight and presumed stock attachment lug are nowhere to be seen. I am surprised as the book is extremely comprehensive. I hope that Herr Mötz can jump in here.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanx for searching your library Ron. Ya, I'm sorry to say my High School German is over 30 years old and only allows me to "struggle" with the language. I've purchased a few big price reference books of late, but at least I can read them. Now concentrating on some hardware.

Do you happen to have some digital images of the "Karabiner" and "1911-II" that you mentioned above?
 

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Koblenz M.7 Roth-Krnka

Dear Fellow Collectors,

I am very busy in finishing vol. 2 of our Austrian pistol book, dealing with the period from 1914 to nowadays. From all new developments of WWI until Glock... It will be published summer or fall of this year (2012). Because I am mentioned in a few posts to this article I respond:

I have to confess that I do not have any idea of that strange WTS (= Wehrtechnische Studiensammlung = Military Technical Reference Collection of the German Federal Army in Koblenz) pistol. I knew and still know a lot of "popes" in the field of arms and ammo which were or are not able to say "Sorry, I do not know". They invented a good sounding story within seconds and a lot of people thought it is true...

I have a good friend with relations to Koblenz and I will ask him to get out as much as possible about this pistol. But I am afraid that the people in Koblenz do not know any details either. I will let you know!

Josef Mötz alias G. Roth from Austria, the country of Mannlicher, Luger and Glock...
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Josef Mötz,
Your candor (and time) is appreciated - and we will hope that your friend may turn something up at Koblenz.

I am still curious to see the "KolbenRoth.jpg" image file you referenced in your Austrian Pistolbook from 10/26/2007, 04:52pm (it doesn't seem to display any longer):

"An experimental carbine pistol, based on the M.7 Roth/Krnka, of 1911.
15 guns made in Budapest for a small troop trial."

Download Attachment:
KolbenRoth.jpg

55.04Â*KB

Otherwise, good luck with your book!
 

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Josef,
I am happy to hear of the progress you're making on vol. II of your books. I have enjoyed vol.I and refer to it often (altho it's in German). I hope you will be able to find an American distributor for your book so that we can obtain them more easily. If your book can be obtained here in the U.S., I hope you will also make your prints of the Repetierpistole M.7. available. Thanks.
Tim
 
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