[Dutchjoe]

I got this dig out Sauer a while ago as a parts gun.
There is something strange about this piece, it has a lanyard ring at the left side of the grip.
The grip plate is cut out for this ring perfectly !!
I thought that only the French made lanyard rings on their captured Sauers, but this is recently dig out and certainly never used by the French.
The serialnumber is gone by corrosion, but you can see the early markings on both sides of the slide.
Who can tell a bit more about this piece of scrap ?

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[Fritz]

Sorry, it was an error

 

[Dutchjoe]

Did I ask a stupid question ?? or does nobody know the answer?

 

[sauerfan]

Dutchjoe,

there are no stupid questions. Only hard to answer questions.

The only Sauer 38-H having a lanyard ring like yours is shown in volume I of Jim Cate's Sauer book. It's serial number 306,xxx (don't have the book at hand presently) and has police eagle/C. Jim describes it has a French post war amendment; only two others would be known.

I don't know anything about French post war amendments - but, personally, the design and place of attachment reminds me on the Dutch Sauer 29 pistol. The Amsterdam police as well as the DvF variations of the Sauer 29 do have the very same type of lanyard ring. So, maybe a post war Dutch amendment? Just a hunch, not more.

Martin

 

[Dgiz]

Dutchjoe,
I will throw in my two cents.
I am not sure where your pistol was located. I am not sure how long it would take a pistol to look like that if it was buried in the ground.
According to Eugene Medlin and Jean Huon, in their new book "French Service Handguns", they state that post production lanyards on these (and other) German wartime pistols are French additions. Page 149 of their excellent book shows a 38H exactly like yours.
We always say post-war when we talk about this addition, but we could mean post-Liberation. With this taking place in mid 1944, a pistol like this could very well have still been lost in combat. The end of the war was a year later.
With so many variations of lanyard ring additions observed on wartime pistols (even on the same models!)it could show that this was a recommended procedure for unit level armorers. So, it would not take long for a pistol to be modified and back in the hands of the soldier.
Just a thought.
Dean

 

[Dutchjoe]

The Amsterdam police used the Sauer M30 (Behordenmodell) delivered by the Fa. Joh. Munts in Amsterdam.
As far as I know the Model 38H is never been used by the Dutch goverment.
I don't know where they dig this thing out, they told me in was found in Holland but I don't know where exactly.
Another thing I don't know are the conditions it was found in, I have seen dig outs that where almost complete gonne after 60 years !!!
The Sauer factory was occupied by the Allies in (March ?) 1945, so if the French changed 38H pistols in 1944, this could only be guns taken from war prisoners !!
Did they have these pistols in such quantities that they would do such changes, and how did this gun ended up in Holland ?
It seems that this mistery will not be solved !!

 

[sauerfan]

Dutchjoe,

quote:It seems that this mistery will not be solved !!

Probably not, unfortunately. But at least, we might get closer to a solution.

In Cate/van Gijn "Automatic pistoly by J. P. sauer & Sohn, Suhl, Waffenstadt", volume I are two 38s shown with the very same feature of a lanyard loop attached to the left side:

1/ SN 306,871, having police acceptance e/C
2/ SN 307,231, having police acceptance e/C

Today I discovered a third Sauer 38 with the very same lanyard loop:

http://www.deactivated-guns.co.uk/detail/Sauer_police.htm

3/ SN 306,925 (or ,926; not quiet sure), having police acceptance e/C

So, all three in a very narrow SN range, all three with police e/C acceptance.

As you, I don't believe in "post war French amendment". The style of the lanyard loop is more or less exactly the same as can be found on the Amsterdam police Sauer model 29, shown hereinafter:


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There is no documentation at all about these Sauer 38-H lanyard loop variations. My guess (not more, not less): a special contract done during the war, not after. Your "dig out" was found in Holland. Seems, it was placed in Dutch soil right after the end of the war and never saw any post war action. So I guess, the amendment was carried out during the war – by Sauer or by some other people... too bad, that there is no serial number and no acceptance marking!

Regards

Martin