Jan C. Still Lugerforums banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

Spandau Lugers

20K views 113 replies 28 participants last post by  Edward Tinker 
I have handy the 1962 revision of Datig's book. The Spandau is noted as "hersay" on p 257 and a hypothetical drawing in included on pg 312.

I also have a copy of Shattucks "Lugers of Ralph Shattuck" ( or something close to that) that I cannot lay my hands on at the moment. My recollection is that Ralph was much more enthusiatic about the existence of Spandau Lugers in that book, noting that several had been verified at a NAPA show. This is subject to the vagaries of my memory and I would appreciate a correction/confirmation from anyone who has the book handy.

My personal opinion is they are an example of the lengths that waffentamp USA will go to make a buck.
 
Bill, since I seem to be the only person on this forum who will admit to owning that book I am trying to find it so I can be more precise in my language. My impression is that Shattuck presented these as products of a Spandau origin with an authentic Spandau stamp. I am hoping to confirm or refute my impression. As to who the verifiers were, I am quite sure he does not report that.
Back to looking
 
Frank, thank you. I finally did find my copy but cosidering the poor quality of my typing you did a better job of it.

Bill, my point is that some dealers are encouraging a market in "Spandau" Lugers while being somewhat obtuse about how bonafide they are. As we note above, apparently the whole convention authenticated these :) but we do not know if they were authenticated as authentically produced by Spandau :) But in any case they are supposed to be worth upwards of $20,000 with the deaths head marked navy variation going for somewhat more.
 
One of the problems with the whole Spandau theory is the German premise that German production at DWM and Erfurt could not keep up with demands and a so the Spandau production was initiated . The theory goes on to say Spandau relied on previously rejected Erfurt parts to supply desperately needed P08s.

None of this makes any sense. There was no shortage. DWM and Erfurt had excess production capability in 1918. Spandau was never the inspection depot for Erfurt. Spandau inspectors accepted DWM production, Erfurt had it own resident Army inspectors
 
Jan Still in Imperial Lugers DWMs estimated total Luger production in 1916 was 160,000 including 20,000 LP08. DWM may also have produced an additional 7900 Naval lugers in 1916. DWM produced 180,000 Lugers in 1917, 90,000 each P08 and LP08. 1917 is obviously the source for the storm troop LP08 armament. Their estimated 1918 production is a total of 143,000 including 25,000 LP08.
The Erfurt production estimates of interest are; 1918, 80,000 P08; 1917, 180,000 P08; and 1918, 175,000 P08.

Also Important is that Russia signed the Treaty of Brest-Litvosk on March 3, 1918 ending the war on the Russian front.

The great storm troop offensives were:
Operation Michael, March 21 to about April 5
Operation Georgette, April 10 to April 29
Operation Blucher, May 27 to May 30
Operation Gneisenau, June 9 to June 11.
After this date the German Armies were greatly weakened by Ludendorf's storm tactics and were stopped. At the battle of Amiens in August 1918 the Allies began driving the Imperial Army gradually back to the Hindenburg Line. The primary German Army need during the withdrawal over open country was the machine gun.

Both DWM and Erfurt increased their production capability by lowering standards of finish and non-esssential fitting on 1918 weapons. Weapons for the German 1918 spring offensive were supplied by DWM and Erfurt from primarily 1917 production, an estimated total of 270,000 P08 and 90,000 LP08.

There was no apparent need for Spandau production of pistols as opposed to a critical need for Spandau production of machine guns.
 
The photographs would suggest it was reworked somewhere that used a pantograph extensively for markings. The "SPANDAU" and the "1918" both appear to be pantographs. Also the Spandau crown appears to have the line on the headband extended beyond the crown profile, which does not appear on the Spandau rifles shown.

Perhaps Graf (or others) could comment on the use of the pantograph at Spandau.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top